In this conversation, I’m speaking with Daniel Thorson on his Emerge podcast. We talk about the relationship between Integral Theory and Metamodernism, the use and misuse of irony & sincerity, and why we should vote, even if it may seem to be statistically meaningless.
“Metamodernism” is exciting and new and significant — I’ll be sharing more about it in the weeks and months ahead. You can get a sneak preview of some of my thoughts in this podcast.
Daniel is quite young, and our intergenerational dialogue explores the textures and implications of the fact that our predicament mandates a cultural transformation that will require engagement and leadership from people of every age — even though our generations have unique sensibilities. In it I take a strong stand against cynicism. (In fact, I regard psychopathy and cynicism as the essential qualities we most need to counter!)
As soon as we begin to become cynical about politics we become a part of the problem. If we have the power to vote, it’s important to do so, and I explain why here.Irony is not necessarily cynicism. We can express our frustrations using irony intelligently, but it’s a slippery slope. Skepticism and ironic humor often cross a line and veer into despair and cynicism. This closes us off from positive creative engagement — and we become the problem we are tending to think is insurmountable. By our moral and intellectual laziness, we make it so.
This is an evolutionary moment. New structures of intelligence and meaning are needed now. Like sprouts coming through the sidewalk, they are finding diverse expressions, and metamodernism, like integral theory, is an important bursting forth of the evolutionary impulse.
You can listen to the podcast here.